Wendy Roop: 0:01

As leaders, we're constantly challenging people's thinking and their perspectives. Our thoughts lead to our emotions, that lead to our actions, that lead to our results. In order to build a strong culture, we have to do that internally first.

Scott McGohan: 0:15

Hey, welcome back to. Culture is an Inside Job. We're here with Karen Benoit Preston and our good friend Wendy Roop. Hey, wendy, today it's all about Wendy day.

Wendy Roop: 0:27

This is weird.

Scott McGohan: 0:30

No, no, we're excited and I and I and I think it's important you know we spent a lot of time talking about you know where Karen came from and her background, and and I think it's important for the listeners to understand you know your, you know where you are today and and the really cool parts is, you know how'd you get to where you were sitting, right, this very spot. So I'm going to turn it over to my good friend, karen. She's going to ask you some questions and I'm going to do my best to interrupt and jump in thanks.

Wendy Roop: 1:01

It's fun to be here with you all too, by the way yeah, yeah, um, okay, cool.

Karen Preston: 1:09

So hey, would you be willing to kind of share with us a little bit about what your story, what is your story, what's your story girl?

Wendy Roop: 1:20

it's a big question. Well, I was born in hinesville, georgia. Um, I didn't live there long. I only lived there the first nine months of my life, but um.

Scott McGohan: 1:32

You're not a. You're not a dog, are you?

Wendy Roop: 1:34

not a dog, okay I'm a george peach, as my grandma used to call me that's a lot better than a dog. Yeah, I and then have been in Ohio ever since then and I mean, how much do you want to know?

Karen Preston: 1:51

Oh, I know let's, yeah, just dive in. What story do we want to know? Yeah, what do you want us to know?

Wendy Roop: 2:00

Well, I want you to know that I have an amazing family. Well, I want you to know that I have an amazing family and family is so, so important to me and I'm probably going to get choked up in all of this. But anyway, I was just blessed to be born to my parents, dick and Pat Smith, and I have two amazing brothers, todd and Chad, and you know I was very fortunate. That family was also very important to my mom and dad and they didn't have like. So my dad's parents lived in Cleveland, my mom's parents lived in some different places but ended up in Florida, so we didn't have a lot of family close to us. So just that family unit, you know. But even our like cousins, who we didn't get to see all the time, like it was important to them that we knew them and even though we didn't get to see them a lot, when we did, uh, it was like yesterday, because I think we all kind of have that um within us that you know you make time for family, you build, build relationships with family and and just growing up I was, you know, really fortunate that my brothers and I were just super close. I'm the oldest of of the two of them. So Todd's a couple years younger than me and Chad's eight years younger, so he's a little baby, so we still tease him about being the baby, but I think that typical. I know it's not always typical, I should be careful with that, but like for me, being the oldest, um, you know, I did find myself feeling like you know I had to be the responsible one and you know I did.

Wendy Roop: 3:36

I was very instilling and protective of my brothers and um, but we were super close and you know, my, my mom was just very, uh, you've both met my mom, Love me some, pat, she is, she is really literally, uh, my angel on earth, but she uh, um, you know, was just really supportive of my dad, um, and so he, my dad, was a corporate guy, I mean family guy too, but very, super smart, and my mom just was, you know, she worked as a lab technician, so she definitely, you know, worked as well, but most of her career she was part time, so she was able to also, you know, be a part of our lives and even in that my dad was great about being at all of our events and so forth, and so when on vacations and just, you know, when I hear about people's stories growing up, I just I'm like, how did I get so lucky, you know, and you know, nobody's perfect. And so I think, as I've gotten older, I, you know, just realize the things that I didn't recognize in the moment, that you know were normal to me. But as I look back and I picked some of those things us, he was very direct, um, he was uh, very traditional, um extremely hard. Uh, hard worker is worth that, worth that good, worth work. I think, if I can talk, um was just so important and, you know, I think all of us picked that up.

Wendy Roop: 5:21

Um, my dad uh had, uh, his parents, um, his dad was an alcoholic. He ended up being a recovered alcoholic, but so he went through his childhood, uh, you know, living in that environment and, um, you know, having a mom that you know, back then they didn't have as many many choices, right, so she just, you know, did what she needed to do, um, you know, a mom, and my dad ended up. You know the stories that our parents or our grandparents tell us, like I walked uphill both ways, you know, to school and so forth, but no shoes in the snow, right, right. And so, of course you know, heard some of those things, but but the reality of it is is that my dad was the oldest of of their family and he did work a few jobs, you know, helping to support the family, not just him.

Wendy Roop: 6:09

And you know he didn't have anyone in his family saying, hey, go to college or, you know, do this. So he did all that on his own. He put himself through Miami University in Oxford and graduated there and was drafted after he got out of college and that's how I ended up being born in Hinesville. He and mom, you know, got married and moved there and then after that came back to Troy and worked for, you know, in corporate America and in you know his career he ended up being the director of benefits and compensation, or compensation benefits for used to be Hobart Corporation in Troy.

Scott McGohan: 6:56

Anyway, and I did not know that.

Wendy Roop: 6:59

Yeah, yeah.

Scott McGohan: 7:01

Is that where you like? You got a little bit of passion for HR.

Wendy Roop: 7:04

I think. So you know and know there's a whole story there too. I think I don't know that I ever really knew what I wanted to do. For sure, for you know, with regards to that kind of job, that I ended up in my you know, being that my dad was really traditional, I, you know he would take us to work with him. Sometimes I would help him put together the benefits books, and you know so I was around, that you know enough to you know, to kind of get a taste of it. But if I'm honest, like what I really thought I wanted to do when I was little was, you know, like I wanted to be a singer. I mean, I went through the whole thing of want to be a teacher or I want to be, but but like when I remember this time when I was like you know what I want to do, I want to be a singer, and I don't know, I was probably 10 years old or something.

Scott McGohan: 7:54

Well, let's give us a little, give us, oh, yeah, yeah girl, that's.

Wendy Roop: 8:00

we just do that at the. No, hey, we just do that at the no.

Scott McGohan: 8:03

hey, let's just see if we missed her calling.

Karen Preston: 8:06

She totally missed her calling Scott.

Scott McGohan: 8:08

I'm totally a witness to this, yeah, I just need you to just pretend like you're on American Idol. Just one short. So you know. Having two brothers, you had to have a nickname. What was your? You had to have one. Did they give you one?

Wendy Roop: 8:22

My brothers no, but my dad especially. But my nickname is Peanut. Oh well, that makes sense I was only five pounds when I was born. I never made it much bigger.

Karen Preston: 8:34

I was going to say aren't you still only about five pounds?

Wendy Roop: 8:38

But yeah, so that's my nickname is Peanut for sure, but yeah, I mean, I is peanut for sure, but, um, but yeah, I mean, you know, I I really did have a passion. I actually, uh, you know, used to be in a lot of plays and I was a dancer and I was, you know, love to love to get on stage in front of people. I used to pretend we had a fireplace at home, um, with a low mantle, and I remember it had a screen on it and you know the little things that you pull to open the screen or whatever. I remember getting on there and using that and pretending that was a microphone.

Wendy Roop: 9:10

You know singing in my house, but you know, my dad was so traditional and he cared so much about and he worked so hard to get where he was that that was scary for him, right, because that isn't something that he could envision. That well, gosh, are you going to be able to make it? Doing something like that and two like that's not, that's not traditional, and are you going to be able to build a life on that?

Karen Preston: 9:37

There was no American Idol back then.

Wendy Roop: 9:39

Right, and there was no American Idol was no American Idol. And so you know so, because I knew it's just so funny how we put so much, you know, so many of us think so much of our parents that you know I didn't want to disappoint him and so my idea of anything like that that wasn't traditional was like, okay, I better, you know better, not even think of that. And so for a while I wanted to be, I thought I wanted to be a pediatrician, until I was about a junior in high school and I took chemistry and I was like nevermind, like I love, I love biology, but not chemistry. So, and you know, wasn't the best in math and things like that. So you know, kind of had that mindset that well, that's probably not the route that I should go, but anyway. So then then finally I you know, when I was getting ready to go off to college, the way I ended up doing what or getting into what I did. So I studied organizational communication Wright State University, shout out. But anyway, and you know, before that, when I wasn't sure, our family doctor, who was also really good friends with us, was over at our house, my mom and dad's house, with us one day and I had just graduated from high school and we were talking about what I should do and I had written something and he was like you know, you need to do something with communication or something like that. And so I just held on to that. You know, I was like, well, somebody like could actually call out what they thought Not that my mom and dad didn't say good thing, great things about me, but as far as what I was going to do with my life. You know, sometimes we hear that in somebody else. And so that's how I ended up going into organizational communication at Wright State and then ended up getting into after I graduated.

Wendy Roop: 11:30

I got a job with the Dayton Power, with Dayton Power and Light on the west side of Dayton, which for me, coming from where I came from, was just a really big deal, and I got to supervise a group of meter readers and it was one of the coolest experiences I've ever had. And so then, fast forward, I got the opportunity to. The way I got into human resources was my dad knew a consultant who worked, you know, some work, hr work with different organizations, and there was an organization where they're at the time I think she was still called like personnel or something like that or have you know. But their manager was getting ready to go on some sort of medical leave and so she was like hey, do you want to? You know, do you want to try this? And so I knew I was ready to leave where I was. So I said, took the chance and said yes. So very quickly I had to learn how to do like payroll and I had to learn how to be the person where some people were coming to about all their HR issues, and I did that for about three months and then after that, ended up landing doing some recruiting for a place called Palmer Plastics. And that's where I landed for about seven years, where I ended up being responsible for all of their human resources by the time that I left for several of their locations doing all aspects of HR and I still have some good friends, you know, from there and just absolutely fell in love with it. And then, when it was time to go, from there, I got some experience in financial services and human resources and then healthcare and I ended up at McGill and Braebender, which was absolutely amazing. And so, talking about how did I get out of HR, getting closer to where I am now is I?

Wendy Roop: 13:27

When he, when I was at EBS asset management, which is also an amazing organization we went through it was during that time where we ended up having to go through several reductions in force, and so, you know, I was responsible, responsible for that strategy and I was like, you know, you don't need me anymore with this many people, and so I exited, and Mago and Brabender we were connected to them and so I had a conversation with them and I ended up joining them more from a culture perspective versus what I was doing, and so took a chance in leaving HR and it started out like they were like, can you be responsible for, like the technical side of training? I'm like I'll do it to get in here, but just so you know, that is not my sweet spot, as you do know, and so you know, this is where, you know, I got the opportunity to start working with Scott so closely and the company as a whole gave me the opportunity to step into things that I never got to do before managing their customer care team, managing their small business team and I'm like what? Like I've never done this, but it was just because I had experience with teams and so forth. You know I was like, okay, I can see how this makes sense. And finally, I think I went to Scott one day and I was like, listen, I just want to be responsible for all of your internal education development. Can I do that? And they were like, yeah, why not? So then I started getting to do that and being responsible for their leadership university and then I got the amazing opportunity to get my coaching certification in 2015.

Wendy Roop: 15:01

And Scott and MB supported me in that in 2015. And Scott and MB supported me in that and in that journey as much as I loved MB. Those of us who have gone through a program like that know that it's life changing and I knew that I was called to something. I was very comfortable there and I loved the people and I loved the culture. But I knew I was called to step out and so I did. And to make a long story short, that's when I ended up as an executive coach internally at CareSource and I got to do that for five years and then, in 2021 is when I got to step out again and start my own coaching practice, and so that's where I'm at now. So all of that, all those years, 54 years, within that number of minutes I just shared with you.

Scott McGohan: 15:49

And, of course, there's a lot of stuff in between. Hey, wendy, when you, you know, and I know, you had a really special relationship with your dad, right, yeah, so when did you lose your dad?

Wendy Roop: 16:00

2019, November or December 2019. 2019, November or December 2019.

Scott McGohan: 16:05

Yeah, your mom is, oh my goodness, she is super special.

Wendy Roop: 16:10

Yeah she is. I tell her all the time like how did I get so lucky? And she's like oh, what do you mean lucky yeah.

Karen Preston: 16:19

She is. She's a good egg.

Scott McGohan: 16:21

Yeah.

Karen Preston: 16:22

I'm curious about when you transitioned to full-time coaching and we were kind of really becoming closer at that point in time and I know there was a struggle in that In terms not so much of where you were but the idea of where you would be going, like the making that leap the willingness to take that risk.

Wendy Roop: 16:50

Yeah, yeah.

Karen Preston: 16:54

Um, how share? Share with us about that transition to full-time coaching.

Wendy Roop: 17:01

Yeah, um. So I just, you know, I think over the years and I had, even when I was working, um a while ago, in human resources, um, I did step out and was working part-time for an organization and I dabbled a little bit in at the consulting in HR, so I had a little bit that entrepreneur taste that I was like, oh, what would it be like? But then I just knew, you know, it's not the right timing. So I had never gotten rid of that feeling, but it was becoming louder, and partly because the alignment, you know, with what I was doing and where I was at and so forth, was not exactly well, I guess there just wasn't the alignment that I, you know, needed anymore, and so I just knew it was important for me to pay attention to that. And so when and Karen and I, you know we met at a retreat and you know we connected, and so actually, karen, you helped me a lot in that right To really to my fear was here.

Wendy Roop: 18:10

I've been inside corporate America for so long, you know, and I know what, I know what I'm not that that I'm wasn't constantly challenging myself when I allowed myself to do that, but I know corporate America right, even all the things we may not like about it, it's I knew it and even though I, it's like I know I have all these skills that I'm bringing.

Wendy Roop: 18:36

It was also such a leap to not be under somebody's umbrella right that like it was all this, you know, pressure on me, and especially from a financial perspective, because not like I had this huge nest egg sitting around saying, okay, you know, now is the time I can, you know I have five years to build this business. It wasn't like that at all. It was a. It was a huge risk and, thank God, my family, my husband, my kids, like everybody, and my friends and so forth so supportive of that, but it was really the, you know, did I have the ability to be able to let go of what I knew and trust myself in stepping into something that was brand new and believe in that vision and dream that I had for myself?

Karen Preston: 19:30

I don't know if that answered your question yeah, totally Bring the thread of culture through this. Yeah, the beginning. You mentioned culture early on, and so where you are now sitting here with really embodying healthy culture, creating the healthy culture, supporting others to create healthy culture, what's tell us?

Wendy Roop: 19:54

about that? What's tell us about that? Well, I think, as you're talking, like I could give you the surface level answer, but it just it really hits in my core. You know, when you say that culture has always been really important to me, like I started in family, right, like having a healthy family unit, thank God, you know, I I learned that from an early, early age and so I held on to that through.

Wendy Roop: 20:22

All of you know the businesses, the companies, you know that I that I worked at, and I remember my dad saying to me too, like they knew, obviously knew me pretty well, and so whenever I would be like, okay, this isn't okay or that isn't okay, and he'd be like, okay, nothing's going to be perfect, wendy, but he also knew enough.

Wendy Roop: 20:41

Because of that, I think, that culture piece that he would say to me he's like when you start having more bad days than good days, it's time for you to make a change, right, and I was very fortunate that not always not very often, you know did I have to leave an organization because of the culture. Like you know, that's happened. But I also knew that, no matter where I went, that was going to be one of the things that I really paid attention to and and and I really got pretty fortunate with that and I think it's because I was so intentional, right, and I didn't have to take something just to take something it was. I was able to see the longer term, like what, what is this place going to do for me and and what am I going to be able to offer to it? So I'll just pause there and then have you ask another question, because my brain, yeah no, I, that's it.

Karen Preston: 21:46

I picked up immediately from the family perspective of that's where culture really started from. From your perspective, and as we all three talked about from the get-go, is culture starts inside of us, right, it's, it starts here and how we show up in our families and in our relationships and in our workplace. You had already you know, you knew what criteria there was that made up what healthy culture looks like, right.

Wendy Roop: 22:15

Right and I had, I'd already had to make some really difficult decisions, you know, professionally and at times. And, and then personally, you know, and I think for those of people who have listened or who know me, you know, to this, you know I've shared my story high level about how my kids and I lost their dad to suicide in October of 2012. And I think that was another huge shift for me is that, with all that we went through, in that and there's a, you know, a much bigger story to that but in all of that it's like, no, like life is too short for us to put ourselves in these situations where, um, we're not taking care of ourself mentally, physically and emotionally, or taking care of other people and and it really comes back, the word that comes so, so simply as kindness, right, um, I know, uh, karen, you especially know that like that, you know, before my dad passed, he said to us so, in when my dad went into the hospital, he wasn't long before he had to be intubated and so, thank goodness, before he did, there were a couple of things that he could say to us. Thank goodness, before he did, there were a couple of things that he could say to us and one of those things before they intubated him was he said if you remember anything at all, if you remember anything at all, remember to always be kind. And it sounds so simple and I just you know, I think that's why I'm so passionate about that and you know how we treat each other, because it sounds so simple but it doesn't happen enough. And even in that and I, you know, I share the story when I talk about that that I don't, he didn't that doesn't just mean with each other or other people, it means with ourselves.

Wendy Roop: 24:29

And going back to what you were saying, karen, about you know, even our podcasting culture is an inside job, you know. And, scott, I know your heart is so much here too. It's like that is a huge piece of that, right. How can we be kind to ourselves? And so I think, going back to my story and why I've made the choices to work or not work, you know, places that I'm at, it's because that is like deep within my roots and I can only go like I'm pretty, you know, you know me well, like I'm pretty even keel, like until I'm not, you know, and it's like when that boundary is crossed, then I feel like I have a responsibility to do something about that and so yeah, so I think that's part of the deeper story.

Scott McGohan: 25:12

I think that's beautiful about your dad too, so thanks for sharing that. I think one of the things, too that's really interesting. So if you had to go back, I've talked to a lot of people that have stepped out of a career into coaching, and I probably talked to more that have not made it than I have those that have made it. So if I, if you could go back and you could, you could grab Wendy by the shoulders and you could give Wendy advice. Yeah, like what advice would you give Wendy in saying, hey, I'm going to, I'm going to step out and we're going to try this Cause? I remember talking to you early on about that. So what advice would you give yourself early on?

Wendy Roop: 25:57

I would say trust yourself, trust your intuition and remember that you ain't new at this right. You have years and years of personal and professional experience and stories, life experiences that you bring to the table. And just because you're starting out new as far as starting a business, make sure that you remember that, remember who you are and whose you are, and just trust and put one foot in front of the other, instead of beating yourself up all the time about maybe what you don't have, or maybe you're not smart enough or right All of those things.

Scott McGohan: 26:47

You know it's interesting, you said this too. Like in the good book, it teaches us what to love our neighbors as ourselves. But that's not the first commandment. The first commandment is to love him. So if I love money, stuff, um, and I, and then that's the way I'm gonna love others like good freaking luck.

Scott McGohan: 27:12

So, I have to take that mindset. And you said that like who, like who you are, you are his right. And then if I understand that love, and then that comes inside of me and self-love, because I've never seen you mad, I'm sure at McGowan I'm sure I made you mad, you were just super mad.

Wendy Roop: 27:32

You saw me mad one time, but we'll talk about that later.

Scott McGohan: 27:34

Oh yeah, me mad one time, but we'll talk about that later. Oh yeah, well, yeah, we'll come out. Yeah, but you're kind of like I don't know, like I ride a unicorn every day and, um, I kind of like the unicorn I ride, I just kind of like it. And you know, to be obvious, you're always optimistic, you always. You're not a skeptic. You see the um, you see the best in other people. I see you look at people and you see the best in them. As far as a mother and what you went through with your husband, you're brave. You're just a really brave, brave person.

Wendy Roop: 28:17

Thank you, scott, I appreciate it and I, you know, I will allow myself to accept that. Thank you being brave, that's not easy for me to, you know, allow myself to take compliments, and so forth. One thing that I'll say, though, is that and I've learned so much about myself is that, while I am I am an optimistic person, I do just very easily, typically right, see the goodness in people, and I and I love people so fast, you know, sometimes to the detriment, um, uh, but talking about, like my own inner critic, like that's the part that people don't see Right, and just like we all have our stuff, and and that is, you know, what I want to just keep coming back to and growing and, and, you know, continuing to allow myself to believe in myself more, because that is also that's going back to what I was talking about, a part of our responsibility, and I just hope that for everyone. Like, believe in yourself and, um, know that you are, you are more than enough.

Scott McGohan: 29:30

Yeah what does that critic say the most? Who's which's the loudest?

Wendy Roop: 29:36

Yeah, a big one is I'm not smart enough, like you're not smart enough, right. And part of that comes again from as amazing as my dad was comes from my dad, not that he said that to me, but because he was so smart and like he was really smart and good with his finances and just he's the type of guy like he knew a little bit about everything I'm not even kidding. He's the type of guy I could say we would at the dinner table, dad, which 325 times 623, right, and he'd be like this, right. And so I compared my, because I looked up to him so much, I compared myself to him, and, and because finances and so forth, money were so important to him, he was a really good. He was really good in like telling us right and us watching him do it. He wasn't the greatest teacher and so and and so, yeah, that inner critic just continued to grow.

Wendy Roop: 30:37

I think, as far as you know, I'm not smart enough, right? In order, in order to be financially free, I have to be smart. Well, I'm not smart enough. I'm not that you know, I'm slow in math, I'm just like you know all these things. So I just keep telling myself that's probably one of the louder ones.

Karen Preston: 30:54

Yeah, that's thanks for being super honest about that too yeah, absolutely so I kind of want to shift gears here a little bit and see if we were to give our audience some really good information here around, if we could support them on creating a healthy culture, to to lean into what does, what do you see would be what would make a healthy culture and how do we help our leaders to build that, develop that? And obviously here with Scott's help, because he's done this right From the inside out.

Wendy Roop: 31:39

I, so I'm, I'm gonna go like there are so many things I could say as far as tools and skills and you know all of these things, but the place I'm gonna go is to what. Something else I'm very passionate about in my work, um, which I call space and grace, and I I really believe so, my whole, the whole concept of space and grace and where it came from is, first of all, because I needed it, and so I call those God downloads right. So a handful of years ago, that just kept coming up for me like space and grace. So, first of all, all me allowing that stuff, that, because I'm a mover and grouver, I'm doing all the time I gotta, do, I gotta, and so I just had this message that, yes, well, that's not going to change. I'm never, I'm not gonna change being the energizer bunny. But where am I not allowing myself to give myself space to be able to have a deeper level of self-awareness around how I'm showing up in the world, how I want to show up in the world, giving myself space to just think, to get some of those downloads right as far as what I'm called to do and who I'm called to be, and then grace, grace, right Like it's, it is about progress, not perfection, and so, actually, there's an acronym that I created. It's so, it's so complicated, it's stop. I'm like I come up with such, you know, creative things, but anyway. So the S stands for self-care, and by that I also mean self-love, and so what is it that we can do for ourselves to make sure we care about ourselves and love ourselves? Because we can't do that. If we don't do that, we can't take care of anybody else.

Wendy Roop: 33:26

And, as a leader, speaking of culture, that's another reason why this is so important. The T stands for think about your thinking. So you know, especially with what Karen and I do as coaches, we're constantly challenging people's thinking and their perspectives. And so, as leaders and you know again, in order to build a strong culture, we have to do that internally first. And so what are our thoughts? And getting real with that? Because when we remember that our thoughts lead to our emotions, that lead to our actions, that lead to our results, right, that helps us to see how that thinking matters.

Wendy Roop: 34:03

And challenging that the O stands for Oasis, and in Oasis, I mean, where is it that you find peace? We all have that different place, and we, again, as leaders, we do not do that enough, we feel guilty for it, we feel like we don't have that different place. And we again, as leaders, we do not do that enough, we feel guilty for it, we feel like we don't have time for it. And I've just discovered for me as an example, like nature is so super important to me and I still don't put myself out there as much as I want to, but I can feel the difference within me when I do, and when I've worked with my clients around that and they are talking about some of those places that they put themselves in and they can find that place of peace, I'm coaching them around. Well, how do you get more of that right, instead of beating yourself up about it?

Wendy Roop: 34:47

And then the P stands for progress over perfection. So you know again, most of us are always in this place of I got to do it right, I have to have all the answers, why don't I have that now? Et cetera, et cetera. And it's really just reminding that you know it is truly about the journey and progress, not about perfection, because that doesn't, that doesn't truly exist. So I think that's what I'd come back to instead of all the things we need to do. I think it's like how do we stop and how do we allow ourselves space and grace in order to show up as the way we want to, so we can then encourage others to do that?

Karen Preston: 35:27

I absolutely love this, and so it's an analogy here that is pretty relevant is if you look at your favorite sports team and you think about what they're doing on Monday morning, they're looking at film from the week before.

Karen Preston: 35:43

They're analyzing the team that's getting ready to play. You know they're going to play next week and so we as organizations don't do that well enough, Right, and so that's stopping slowing down, giving yourself the space to reflect, get the data and understand how do we tweak what needs to be pivot. You know how do we pivot what's different, what needs to be different, All those micro, micro decisions to allow us to move more agilely and more resiliently. Because we've taken the time to have the data, we can speed up in the curve which allows us to move forward and progress, like you say, because oftentimes we're not slowing down enough and what happens then, of course, as we know, is we keep going and we keep going and the wheels aren't tight, and now we've lost one, and now we're like train wreck. So how do we help organizations understand the importance of stop of slowing down, giving yourself space and grace, recognizing the reflection opportunity to get the data so that we can do these smaller tweaks and pivot as we need to. Yes.

Wendy Roop: 36:52

I love that. Karen and Scott, you and Karen, you know, we know that we've all heard this and both personally and professionally that you know if people hear messages like this or somebody invites them to do something to slow down, right, they're like I don't have time to do that and what I have literally been saying to people, including myself, is you don't have time not to.

Karen Preston: 37:15

What is it costing you not to? What's the future cost?

Wendy Roop: 37:19

And so I think it is like just inviting people to reflect on that. It's like understanding that you don't have time not to, because what is the impact of it and what is it costing you by not? And we know too right, when we coach with people, or have you, they're always like, okay, that's great, now how do I I fix it? Or how you know, sometimes you just got to sit in it, you know and realize, gosh, you know how is this impacting my life? And again, for me it is a it's not how I'm wired. I'm not wired to stop, I'm not wired to slow down, and so it is a journey. And so I'm constantly reminding myself of that. And when I talk, friends or whatever you know and I'm and they're like no, about space and grace, cause I have retreats on it, you know, they're like space and grace, wendy, space and grace. I'm like yeah, have you ever?

Scott McGohan: 38:07

have you ever been to a dog track?

Wendy Roop: 38:09

Yes.

Scott McGohan: 38:10

So they chase something called sparky, and it took me a long time to figure this out in life. But they never catch them, ever. And when we realized that if cases are a drug of choice, it just does not end well but it feels so, it feels really good because you know I'm getting stuff done and it is my drug of choice. So today, for example, it is 1.41. I'm telling you, first time in my life I have not turned on a TV the entire day.

Wendy Roop: 38:51

That's a big deal. It is a big deal.

Scott McGohan: 38:53

Because I was outside with my wife and she's like she said I saw you look at the TV and you're like, why haven't you turned like the today show on? And I was like I said, okay, I'm going to try it, I'll see if I can get through it. And you know, I don't know. But gosh, sometimes and you're right, wendy we just have to give ourselves some room to say and I'm so bad at this, it's, it's gotta be my worst trait that it's it's okay, to sit back and do nothing.

Wendy Roop: 39:23

Yeah, yeah, and I, I love that, and, and I, and what I wrote down as you were talking, and, and Karen, this is based on what you were saying too, and we talked to our clients about this too, and myself is it's's a, it's like that comparison between doing and being, and so instead of and maybe this is another you know opportunity, right instead of, what do you need to do? It's like how do you need to be right and and and sometimes that is just sitting, it might be journaling, it might be walking, so it's not like you have to be completely stationary, but it's like what is it that's going to allow you to just feel the feelings and think the thoughts, which is why we don't, because we're afraid of it, and me too, right it's uncomfortable.

Wendy Roop: 40:08

All of us have a story, and so it's like it's not that we're doing it saying well, I'm going to do this, so I don't think about this, but it becomes our operating system.

Karen Preston: 40:24

The other thing that I've just recently come across, sorry, scott, would be when we keep it inside of us, those thoughts and the feelings, it's only able to be viewed subjectively. And what I've learned is how, when we can put that outside of us, like you say, either journaling or recording it or somehow or another getting it out of us we can now start to be more objective with it and discern where is there fear, judgment, what's holding me back? What's the truth of this? What worked, what didn't? That's again that piece of the importance of reflection. So we get the data, because now we can know what's different about what would need to be different. But keeping it inside of us, we're shallowing. You know, our ego perspective is only subjective.

Scott McGohan: 41:11

Yeah.

Karen Preston: 41:12

So balancing that ability to get it outside of us. Get somebody else look at it, hey, so balancing that ability to get it outside of us. Get somebody else look at it, hey. What do you see in this? Yeah, guaranteed somebody else might see a different perspective of it, right? So how true is it? My way isn't the only way. So, yeah, just really taking that time.

Wendy Roop: 41:34

It's really, it's so valuable so critical and so uncomfortable, and I think that's a really huge, important piece of leadership too. And culture is vulnerability and it looks different for all of us, right, but, but, but just keep leaning into that.

Scott McGohan: 41:50

So I think you said something too in regards to like, you know, like silence. That's where I mean, that's where shame grows, that's where comparison grows, and you know, when we say something, it gets. It gets out of this noggin and spins around and I believe it, like it, it goes, maybe it has to go come through our heart right Before it comes out of our mouth and it's like huh, is that? So? Then all of a sudden, we get reflection like is that true? Most of the time it's not. It's a warped sense of truth, and when you say something, then it's not silent, and then we lose, like it loses all its power. Yeah, and, and you're exactly right about you know, I think, as a leader too, you have to ask yourself would you follow yourself? And if you would, why? Which I think most people would say I don't know. Well, just get super honest, why you wouldn't and, it's very likely, why maybe some people aren't following you, does that?

Wendy Roop: 42:52

make sense, oh yeah.

Karen Preston: 42:53

Yeah, yeah. So, wendy, bring us inside and wrap this up for us. What might our audience, what's a great question that we would help them go inside with?

Wendy Roop: 43:08

gosh, I think you know just simply how are you going to allow yourself more space and grace and when you do, what's the impact of it? And just allowing yourself to sit with that, I think that's it, I love that, thank you.

Karen Preston: 43:27

I've been doing it myself, so I can definitely see the benefit Good.

Wendy Roop: 43:31

I love that. I love, I think that too right Just in. That is like that's the importance of having an accountability person in your life, or accountability people. It's like when we can be vulnerable and sharing out loud like what we're trying, what we're changing, what we're you know. We can come back to supporting each other in that that, because otherwise this world can be a really lonely place. You know it's hard enough. So I think that's the other thing I'd offer is, as people are allowing themselves that is, who is it that you can bring into that space with you and realize that you know you're not alone in that?

Karen Preston: 44:12

So, as a coach for our audience, how can they get in touch with you if they needed an accountability partner?

Wendy Roop: 44:19

Yeah, so I'm on LinkedIn, Wendy Rupp coaching, and then Instagram is Wendy Rupp coaching and Wendy Rupp coaching at gmailcom is my email. Anything else I'm missing. You know I'm not great with the whole.

Karen Preston: 44:39

Yeah, we don't do that often enough, do we? But that's it, that's great. Identifying your email address is perfect and you can always find us in our show notes and so forth where there are other connections. Yes, for sure.

Scott McGohan: 44:56

Yeah, I think, if you're interested in coaching, it's it. I see this like have you ever? It's like cleaning your garage and there there are times when you clean your garage and you maybe, if you have a storage cabinet, that's where, that's where everything goes. For that you don't want to see right, and if you're really good at cleaning your garage garage you might even get the hose out and clean it. But I think a really good coach helps you drag every ounce of stuff out of that garage and then, before you put it back in, you gotta have a conversation like when's the last time you use this? It's like I don't want to talk about. I don't want to talk about that purge yeah, like the massive purge.

Scott McGohan: 45:38

But if you've ever, you know, if you ever clean your garage out or cause your trunk out or done something, just incredible, and when you're finished it just feels so good and so freeing and then you have so much space, you're like um, cause I've done it before, where I've actually cleaned. Then I've gone back and I've just like admired it, like this is awesome. Now I'm kind of crazy, so I but I do think that what both both Karen and what you do for people is is just it, just beautiful, cause really what you do is you just bring about their potential. That's, it's always been there.

Karen Preston: 46:18

Yeah, always been there. You help them get there's clarity right. I mean, just even in the reflections that I've done in the last few weeks, that I've been taking that space and grace. I come out of that and one of the questions I say is how do I feel now? And I'm immediately feel lighter and clearer about what's next. So, yeah, it's transformational.

Wendy Roop: 46:40

I love that and I do think right, what is the multiple right? But what are some of the gifts of coaching? Having a coach is having that space, having the safe space with no judgment, right, instead of someone coming out and judging your garage Garage, your garage is a mess someone coming out and judging your garage Garage.

Karen Preston: 46:58

Your garage is a mess. Time to clean your garage.

Wendy Roop: 47:03

Thanks for holding the space for me today, absolutely.

Karen Preston: 47:08

Thank you for being so vulnerable.

Scott McGohan: 47:11

Yeah, thanks for joining us on Cultures and Inside Job. Looking forward to next time, wendy, I think we'll probably unpack a. I'm looking forward to next time and, wendy, I think we'll probably unpack a few more things about you the next time we're together no-transcript.